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Fruity Loops.
February 22, 2013
5:56 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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I know a lot of people will assume that I'm attacking Jesus Is Savior for being Christian, but it's not really a christian website it's a fear campaign for religion. Like, Jesus Is Savior is the George Bush of Christianity. “They hate us for our freedom!!!”

February 22, 2013
6:11 pm
scruffy
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agreed, but, drifting back towards the topic…

whats your production methodology, lucem? 

or, anyone else?

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
6:37 pm
Preachy The Clown
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Ive been using a 4trak recorder for the longest time now when i record vocals and some beats but they are not as intricate as i would like. I make beats on FL and its cool for what i want to do sound wise but im trying to learn more. I have a Behringer Mixer that i use with the 4trak and i usually give it to my father n Law to make into an mp3. Its not the most pro sounding but it does have a garagey kinda punk rok sound that gives it a kinda charm. My site is

thexsp238.bandcamp.com

 if you got any constructive feedback please let me know im always up to learn.

February 22, 2013
6:40 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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scruffy said:

agreed, but, drifting back towards the topic…

whats your production methodology, lucem? 

or, anyone else?

I usually just end up messing around with the keyboard until something sounds good then I think “I should make this into a beat”.

Then I take the riff or tune that I created and apply it to the instrument or synth that I want then usually end up equalizing it and providing the effects i want on it (like echo or reverb or stereo) and sometimes, if it really needs it, I’ll compress it.

Then I usually add another instrument that gives it polyphony, usually a tune or riff that either compliments the original one or a copy and paste of the same exact riff as the original one.

Maybe I might add another instrument, I usually keep a few so the verse has stuff to come in and build on. Also keep in mind that I have the same ritual for each new instrument I introduce where I equalize, add effects, and sometimes compress.

I usually add a bass and the beat before I start constructing the first verse. The bass’s riff is decided like any other instrument, usually a repeat of the original tune. (if the main tune is made up of chords then take the key from each cord that makes the biggest difference when it changes). The beat is usually repetitive through out the song, maybe starting out with just the kick and snare then adding some hats. During the hook I usually add something to it to make it more intense.

When Equalizing the drums (which I usually take every drum and put it under the same insert) and the bass be careful because these two things are the bass of the whole song, you want the drums and the bass (of course) to have bass. What I do is I give the bass just regular bass (not too much) while I turn down the sub bass then I give the drums the sub bass while I take turn down just the regular bass.

Always add something extra or something less to the chorus to give it a good feel.

None of this is actually set in stone though, I just really do what I think will sound good.

Oh, and when adding a reverb to the drums, try to make it so low that you can barely hear it. It might seem weird but it tends to sound better than just dry drums. Gives the drums that extra pop.

 

Edit: I forget to warn why you have to be careful with the bass and drums, if you equalize them wrong then they will distort when both are playing at the same time, it will have a bass overload.

February 22, 2013
6:45 pm
scruffy
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Preachy The Clown said:

if you got any constructive feedback please let me know im always up to learn.

contemporize.

that, and, dont charge for garage quality music.

cant give feedback on the music itself, as i wont be paying. 

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
6:48 pm
scruffy
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Lucem Ferre said: 

Edit: I forget to warn why you have to be careful with the bass and drums, if you equalize them wrong then they will distort when both are playing at the same time, it will have a bass overload.

two words:  headroom.

okay, so its one word, but, yeah…

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
6:52 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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Try recording multiple versions of your verses. You might fuck up and not realize it until later. If you do then you have other verses to choose from, to get that best quality. If all verses have a spot where you fuck up, cut and paste the good parts of each verse to make on giant good verse (as long as it all sounds fluid and legit) I personally would rather just have one really well performed verse rather than having to cut and paste because I always think, “If I can't even perform it right when recording it what makes my think I can perform it live?” but it's usually easier to memorize and master your performance if you have a song to listen to and drive into your brain.

February 22, 2013
6:56 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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scruffy said:

Lucem Ferre said: 

Edit: I forget to warn why you have to be careful with the bass and drums, if you equalize them wrong then they will distort when both are playing at the same time, it will have a bass overload.

two words:  headroom.

okay, so its one word, but, yeah…

Yeah, awesome thing about FL is that it has db meters for each insert so you can see when it goes over the limit or not. Plus, when you use the FL Equalizer 2 it has a little display that shows what exactly is causing the distort, between highs, lows, and mids. Didn't know what it was called though, just going off of what I observe.

February 22, 2013
7:01 pm
scruffy
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i tend to prefer low end bass when mixing, so the kicks get no cutoff.  the rest of the drums, i cut off almost every time.  contributes to the aforementioned headroom.

for eq and other purposes, i like to seperate drums into:  kicks and other low freq effects; snares, blocks, claps and other hits; and hats, crashes, etc.  after that, i usually premix them, and use that for the dry signal going to reverb or tape echo.  oh, and when applying reverb [and other effects, but especially reverb], i do not like to have the wet and dry signals mix before output.  this invariably leads to beading, phasing, all kinds of problems.  wet only output.  if i really have to, ill set up a seperate sidechain.  way better control, that way. 

 Yeah, awesome thing about FL is that it has db meters for each insert so you can see when it goes over the limit or not.

when building up the track, ideally none of the meters will get anywhere near clipping.  youll probably end up losing a lot of dynamic range if they do.

maximizing volume should be held until near the end.  really, thats a function of the mixdown.   

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
7:07 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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scruffy said:

i tend to prefer low end bass when mixing, so the kicks get no cutoff.  the rest of the drums, i cut off almost every time.  contributes to the aforementioned headroom.

for eq and other purposes, i like to seperate drums into:  kicks and other low freq effects; snares, blocks, claps and other hits; and hats, crashes, etc.  after that, i usually premix them, and use that for the dry signal going to reverb or tape echo.  oh, and when applying reverb [and other effects, but especially reverb], i do not like to have the wet and dry signals mix before output.  this invariably leads to beading, phasing, all kinds of problems.  wet only output.  if i really have to, ill set up a seperate sidechain.  way better control, that way. 

 Yeah, awesome thing about FL is that it has db meters for each insert so you can see when it goes over the limit or not.

when building up the track, ideally none of the meters will get anywhere near clipping.  maximizing volume should be held until near the end.  really, thats a function of the mixdown.   

Now that I actually broke down and got the pirated version of FL I should start separating all of my low freq drums and my high freq drums. I've already started getting into the detail (with just the trial version) of going into the piano role and adding each drum individually so I can add spots where the pattern will change a little or where the beat just drops so I don't have 50 different patterns.

February 22, 2013
7:09 pm
scruffy
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oh, use the piano roll, for certain! 

the legacy pattern editor flat out sucks.  really inflexible.

 

[edit]  its far better, as well, to restrict each pattern to a single channel [usually, not a necessity, though].

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
7:12 pm
scruffy
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also, dont use the packs.  fuckin everybody uses the packs, its an easy way to spot songs made with fl. 

it takes time to build a sample library, or to synth it yourself [particularly drums], but its way worth it.

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
7:26 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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scruffy said:

also, dont use the packs.  fuckin everybody uses the packs, its an easy way to spot songs made with fl. 

it takes time to build a sample library, or to synth it yourself [particularly drums], but its way worth it.

Oh, dude I think I have like 4gb of just drums. I could probably add them into one of the various drum samplers because it'd allow me to put each drum in their own separate insert (for the dry effects) and then put the whole thing into an insert for the wet effects since I usually only add reverbs to my drums. I really want to get more samples/presets for DW though. The presets for DW are amazing for live instruments, next best thing to having them actually played live. I really really want some good choir presets though. I usually use the original choir they provide or these presets I downloaded for the Soundfont synthesizer. The sounfont sounds horrible and you have to do hours of tweaking and adjusting to get the choir to sound just right. I guess it'd be best for things like choirs acapellas is to get them done live but I don't have the money or the resources for that. Would really like some awesome guitar and music box presets as well. Hell, there's tons of instruments I'd like to be able to use. Hey, at least they have that sexy ass saxophone.

February 22, 2013
7:31 pm
The Warlock
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Lucem Ferre said:

Would really like some awesome guitar and music box presets as well. Hell, there's tons of instruments I'd like to be able to use. Hey, at least they have that sexy ass saxophone.

http://www.looperman.com/ might be able to help ya with that..

February 22, 2013
7:37 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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The Warlock said:

Lucem Ferre said:

Would really like some awesome guitar and music box presets as well. Hell, there's tons of instruments I'd like to be able to use. Hey, at least they have that sexy ass saxophone.

http://www.looperman.com/ might be able to help ya with that..

Those are all loops and samples, I want something that I can edit in the piano roll to create my own melodies that sounds pretty legit. If you work with one sample then it'll sound like shit when you edit it in the piano roll. With the DW they take samples from each note and add it to one big sampling instrument.

February 22, 2013
7:39 pm
The Warlock
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ahh alright…

February 22, 2013
7:41 pm
scruffy
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i dont use directwave too much.  i suspect that the content library keeps trying to get online and rat me out for using stolen software…  that, and its kinda processor and memory intensive.   

flslayer isnt too bad for rockdafied guitar stuff, as long as youre attentive to the settings that youre tweaking.  after that, dw.  after that, hire guitarist. 

choir voices are problematic with flstudio.  the packs are extremely overused, and as such require lots and lots of tweaking to sound both original and good.  in this case, the best thing is probably to start with the sytrus presets, and see what you can come up with, using very minor, incremental adjustments.  still takes a lot of time.  if you are the shit, it is utterly possible to build a killer voice from scratch using sytrus or another synth, but god, its difficult.

that actually applies to guitars, too.  in fact, any fm synth with as much capability as sytrus can make literally any sound there is.  assuming, like i say, that you school the fuck out of it. 

 

[edit]  after a quick look at looperman, it seems like the last refuge of the untalented. 

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
7:51 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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scruffy said:

i dont use directwave too much.  i suspect that the content library keeps trying to get online and rat me out for using stolen software…  that, and its kinda processor and memory intensive.   

flslayer isnt too bad for rockdafied guitar stuff, as long as youre attentive to the settings that youre tweaking.  after that, dw.  after that, hire guitarist. 

choir voices are problematic with flstudio.  the packs are extremely overused, and as such require lots and lots of tweaking to sound both original and good.  in this case, the best thing is probably to start with the sytrus presets, and see what you can come up with, using very minor, incremental adjustments.  still takes a lot of time.  if you are the shit, it is utterly possible to build a killer voice from scratch using sytrus or another synth, but god, its difficult.

that actually applies to guitars, too.  in fact, any fm synth with as much capability as sytrus can make literally any sound there is.  assuming, like i say, that you school the fuck out of it. 

I don't know if I'm good at actually making sounds, but I could try. I'd definitely try it out on Harmless, shit on Harmless sounds 10X better than shit on Sytrus. The organs that they have on Harmless sound just like the real instrument. Possibly Poizone, Biohazard too.

For guitars now what I do is get one of the acoustic DWs or the synths and plug them into the Hardcore effect which works like an amp. It sounds much better than the presets on Slayer which you usually need to tweak so people can't automatically tell it was made in FL. Plus, I can get that old school 70s metal effect and that distorted Korn effect.

February 22, 2013
8:23 pm
scruffy
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harmless isnt too bad, harmor is superior, but a bit more involved.  poizone is good for techno dub steppy sounding stuff.  id say that the only thing biohazard has on sytrus is a prettier gui. 

when it comes to synths, sytrus is my starting point, and more often than not, it does the job. 

you can get about any rock guitar sound out of flslayer, take a little time to see if you can noodle it out.  it does help if your familiar with electric guitars at the outset.  but, yeah, dont use the presets. 

dw with hardcore is a safe bet, actually.  i havent delved too deep into hardcore, guitars not being a major component of my idiom.  assuming good quality, though, it should be fine.  probably better than fine, really.  if its as advertised, probably better than flslayer, like you said. 

  awfully paranoid, arent you?   

February 22, 2013
8:32 pm
King Lucem Ferre
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You can mix the acoustic FL Slayer to the Hardcore too, get some great shit out of it. Hardcore is great for some industrial distortion though, for that crispy OG CombiChrist sound. That and the distortion preset for the Fruity Love Philter. I also, before I got the full version, used to use Green Machine too. Green Machine is like a shittier Hardcore. Green Machine is to Hardcore like Gsnap is to AutoTune.

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